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Fish Felon
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Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:19 am

4-wheelers are tools. They are a piece of equipment for specific jobs and they were designed and developed as such.

They're great for dragging a deer out of the woods, plowing your driveway, getting decoys into a muddy field, and getting to places ice fishing you're truck would either get stuck or fall through. In that sense they can be pretty bad ass. Driving them while doing any number of chores or jobs can be pretty fun.

But...

...if you and a couple buddies like to load up your wheelers and go on a bro-date "riding" them somewhere special for the sole purpose of "riding" them....


...then you are one gigantic F-A-G.


I can only think of a few things more flamingly homosexual.


What's next, a tractor park? Don't the dudes with tractors need a special place they can meet up with their other buds that have tractors and tool around and then share a cold one in the parking lot and talk about how sick the trails were and share your close calls because you're so extreme?. Where are they going to go to give the guy riding an international some friendly shit because the other guy has a deere, and vice versa?

WTF is wrong with people? Riding a 4 wheeler just to ride it is so phucking gay.

THEY'RE NOT MEANT FOR THAT! They handle like you're riding a box with wheels because that's what they are!

If tooling around some organized trails on an ATV trips your trigger then you really need to make some changes. Start doing some hard drugs. Lots. Or quit doing drugs if you already are on them.

Or here's an idea...

...if you really want to have some fun riding trails...

....BUY A PHUCKING DIRT BIKE.

ATV plan on Legacy-bought land draws fire
Saint Paul Pioneer Press (MN), 2015-02-15

Feb. 15 --A plan to maintain more than 25 miles of ATV trails with Legacy Amendment-bought land near Brainerd has a number of key wildlife-habitat officials crying foul.

Crow Wing County is entertaining a proposal by a local ATV club to make official and maintain a network of trails within a 1,857-acre complex of forests, wetlands and Mississippi River shoreline purchased with $11 million from the state's Outdoor Heritage Fund .

The county's land manager and the head of the ATV club behind the proposal note that four-wheelers have been using the property for years and no new trails are planned. But several lawmakers and conservation leaders are demanding scrutiny, with some even suggesting the state could seize control of the land if the project moves ahead as envisioned.

The dustup has raised concerns among some that buying property with Legacy funds and handing it over to local units of government risks betraying the principle voters supported in 2008 when they approved a constitutional amendment to raise sales taxes to "protect, enhance, and restore" wildlife habitat.

It also underscores longtime tensions between motorized recreation and non-motorized uses and highlights a fundamental question officials were left with after the amendment passed: How intensely can humans use a landscape without violating that mandate?

"Habitat is destroyed by recreational ATV use in the summertime," said Bill Becker , former executive director of the Lessard-Sams Outdoor Heritage Council who was directly involved in the taxpayer-funded purchase of the land.

Becker accused Crow Wing County officials of being "disingenuous" in representing their plans for the land -- a charge a county official disputed.

The Outdoor Heritage Council is charged with vetting projects vying for a piece of the roughly $100 million in annual proceeds that the Legacy Amendment generates for wildlife habitat. That's a third of the total annual funds generated by the Legacy Amendment, which also funds projects for clean water, parks and trails and arts and cultural heritage.

The Outdoor Heritage Council supported the plan to buy the land, which had been targeted by conservationists for years as prime real estate worthy of protection, and in 2012 the legislature and governor authorized spending $11 million to buy it for the county.

The Mississippi Northwoods Habitat Complex Protection initiative was hailed as the crown jewel of the Outdoor Heritage Fund for its eternal protection of nearly three undeveloped miles of the Mississippi and expanses of backwoods and wetlands used by ducks, deer, woodcocks, ruffed grouse and those who hunt them just east of Brainerd . The backwaters of the stretch of Mississippi are spawning grounds for muskellunge, otters, fishers and weasels lope along the river banks, and rare species, such as the Blanding's turtle and red-shouldered hawk, have been known to nest there.

ATVS NOT NEW

The property was previously owned by Potlatch Corp. The timber company had built a network of logging roads and for decades allowed ATVs to roam the trails.

Russell Heittolla of Brainerd first rode his four-wheeler in those woods in the early 1990s.

"That area is one of the nicest trail-wise," said Heittolla, 44, trail coordinator for the Cuyuna Iron Range Riders ATV club. "We went back in there on these nice trails that were wide enough for two vehicles to meet without any problems. There are scenic views of the river. It's just a great place to ride."

When Crow Wing County took over the land, via the Legacy funds, the riding never stopped. The county's motorized-vehicle policy is opposite from state policy. In state forests, ATVs are prohibited from riding anywhere that's not posted as a designated ATV trail. In Crow Wing County , riders can go anywhere unless an area is posted as off-limits.

Heittolla and his club are proposing to make those trails official, so they will appear on maps, feature signs, and be eligible for state grants doled out to such clubs to maintain trails for safety and environmental protection. The club has submitted its plan to the county for approval, and the application is in the first stage of a five-stage process that could last between five and 15 months. A map of the proposed system shows trails crisscrossing the land and adjoining county-owned parcels, with at least nine loops inside the Legacy-bought acres.

Nothing has been approved, but Kirk Titus , land services supervisor for Crow Wing County , said he believes ATVs should be allowed to continue and a management plan for the trails will help improve safety, the environment and riders' experience.

"What we really seek out there is some sort of managed designated trail system," Titus said. "There's all kinds of people using it during the hunting season. What we would like to do is manage them."

ORIGINAL INTENT?

There are varying opinions as to Crow Wing County's flexibility regarding ATV trails on the land, and a number of people involved in the purchase have begun digging through documents, notes and their own memories.

Several members of the Outdoor Heritage Council said their intent was never for a forest roaring with motorized vehicles.

"It was going to be a habitat project. It wasn't going to be a recreational project," said David Hartwell , the council's current chair and a member of the council since its inception.

"I probably thought they weren't going to be allowed there," said Rep. Denny McNamara , R- Hastings , a member of the council, which includes citizens and lawmakers.

"It clearly doesn't seem to be the intended use," said Becker, whom council members relied on for facts and guidance when weighing the project's value. "I'm disappointed by this. They ( Crow Wing County officials) didn't testify any intent to do this. ... They represented the use of those roads as an access issue and not a recreation issue. You gotta get in there to go hunting and you gotta get in there to slip a canoe in the river. So I envisioned there might be some vehicle use, but not ATVs as a recreation in itself. That's not what the fund was for."

Hartwell, McNamara and state Rep. Rick Hansen , DFL-South St. Paul, who also serves on the council, said any land that was intended for recreational ATV use should have come from the Parks and Trails Fund , a separate and small fund of Legacy Amendment dollars intended for developed parks, not the Outdoor Heritage Fund .

LEGAL QUESTIONS

Although critics said they were taken aback by the extent of ATV use on the land, it doesn't appear anyone with the council ever told Crow Wing County officials to outright ban ATVs.

An official with the Trust for Public Land , which brokered the sale, said he was researching the transaction to get a clearer picture of what all parties believed was the intended use of the land.

The law that authorized the purchase specifically prohibits the development of a "paved trail" without Outdoor Heritage Council approval. The provision was added because council members knew that a paved bicycle trail to link the Cuyuna Lakes State Trail and the Paul Bunyan State Trail was envisioned, and the council has taken a dim view of paving of any surfaces on land intended for wildlife above all else.

But the ATV trails aren't paved, and Titus noted that the land was "to be added to the county forest system," according to numerous documents, as well as the legislation itself.

"We always said that we would maintain the property under our forest management plan like our other 110,000 acres of county forests," Titus said. Like many rural counties, recreational off-road vehicle opportunities are an integral part of Crow Wing's forest management plan.

Bob Meier , the DNR's lead lobbyist, said the grant agreement -- the document that legally committed the state funds to the purchase -- does note the potential for motorized use. "They're following the terms of the grant agreement," he said.

'ATV PARK'?

But Meier said the map he's seen involves so many trails that it could alter the landscape to such a degree that wildlife is affected, as is access to hunting and fishing -- two recreational activities not specified in the Legacy Amendment itself but so closely associated with it that the Outdoor Heritage Council demands they be allowed on all lands unless other laws prevent it.

"You've got spring turkey hunting, small game hunting in September and of course the fall deer season," he said. "You've got real problems doing those if this becomes an ATV park. We're not anti-ATV, but they never said 'ATV park.' The real question is whether this alters the use of the land."

Several critics used the phrase "ATV park" or "county park" in suggesting that the extent of the trail network and amount of ATV activity is a nuanced but crucial question.

"What if it gets turned into an ATV park in 10 years?" Hansen said. "Is that permanent protection for $11 million ? I would say no. This is nothing against ATVs. This about what it means to protect."

Titus said the whole point of the county's process to review the ATV application is to determine the environmental impacts of the trails. "We have to let this process work," he said. He noted that the county's plan carries the seal of approval from two third-party stewardship programs: the Sustainable Forest initiative and the Forest Stewardship Council .

"As such, our management of the property is focused on protecting the integrity and longevity of forest lands, habitat, and enhancement of recreational opportunities," he wrote in a Feb. 11 letter to Mark Johnson , current executive director of the Outdoor Heritage Council . Johnson and Titus exchanged letters last week as lawmakers and members of the council became aware of the ATV plan, which was originally submitted in November and also would allow mountain biking and horseback riding on the trails.

LEVERAGE

Critics of the ATV plan might have leverage over Crow Wing County .

The DNR controls state grants that ATV clubs rely on to maintain trails, and Crow Wing County needs the Outdoor Heritage Council's permission for a separate plan they have for Mississippi Northwoods.

County officials have envisioned taking 160 acres of the project along Minnesota 210 and converting it to commercial use. Titus said the county is considering the notion of swapping those acres with another 160 acres of county-owned land that borders Mississippi Northwoods on one side and Crow Wing Regional Airport on the other.

Everyone agrees such a swap needs approval from the council, and a number of council members are wary of the idea because the "new" 160 acres has no road access and is effectively wildlife habitat today.

Lastly and perhaps most significantly, the state might have the ability to simply seize control of the land.

"I would remind ( Crow Wing County officials) that the statute provides for returning property to the state if it's not being used for its intended use," Becker said.

Meier said the possibility has come up in his discussions with lawmakers.

"I think the legislature is more than likely to take a hard look at this if it really becomes an ATV park," Meier said.

Dave Orrick can be reached at 651-228-5512. Follow him at twitter.com/OutdoorsNow .

ATV PLAN

To see the proposed trail network, go to blogs.TwinCities.com/outdoors

___

(c)2015 the Pioneer Press (St. Paul, Minn.)

Visit the Pioneer Press (St. Paul, Minn.) at http://www.twincities.com

Distributed by Tribune Content Agency, LLC
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Goldfish
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:06 am

Man, kinda throwing all the bait out at once to hook someone, aren't ya?

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Fish Felon
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 5:08 am

Goldfish wrote:Man, kinda throwing all the bait out at once to hook someone, aren't ya?

Daahaha! Oh Crap! Geez Goldfish, was I that obvious? Golly-gee-whiz you really saw right through my attempt...pert near read me like a book I'd say Goldy! Jeepers criminy!!!



Since you're accusing me of trolling (again) it's only logical to assume you disagree with my stance. Fair?

So....that means you're in favor of $11 million in land purchased under the legacy amendment being turned into a trail riding complex for 4-wheelers?

Could you elaborate as to why you think that?



Look Goldfish, you seem like a good guy. I'm sure if we shared a blind we'd have a decent time...and you'd realize I'm just as opinionated in real life. At the risk of sounding condescending, I'm quite a bit older and at a different stage of hunting development than you and most the guys over at DHC. Again, not at all trying to talk down to you....I'm actually pretty jealous of you guys. I enjoy lurking over there and wish I could still get amped about most of the thread topics, but alas, I cannot. You got a great group of guys all kind of figuring stuff out and advancing together. Enjoy it while it lasts because the figuring it out part is the best. It's hard to imagine but some day you might be like me...loading up a bag of decoys you haven't gone through since last season the night before opener and sleeping soundly until your alarm goes off with just enough time to be set up five to ten minutes past legal shooting.

That's why I don't post on DHC. I'm not a dick, or at least that big of a dick, to go on there and phuck with you guys and try to spoil your fun. If I really wanted to am I capable of it? Certainly. But that would be trolling and I'm not a troll. Like I said before, I enjoy lurking there and respect what you have going.


With that being said, don't expect it to work here like it does over there. Why would you even want it to?

What I'm getting at is quit the troll remarks. This website is a different channel, or show, and it's OK to like more than one show or channel. Feel free to jump in and contribute. Every thread I've posted is centered around a legitimate outdoor current event. If you don't like my take that's fine, no need to worry about offending me...as long as you share your opinion in the process of doing so.

There's nothing more telltale of a troll than bashing someone's opinion without offering up their own.




I'm really confused by how you could read what I wrote and question it's sincerity??? It's not like I said, "4-wheelers are gay," and that's it. I have nothing against ATVs. They are very useful tools that are often more fun to ride than it is to walk.

On this issue most people are going to focus on whether or not land paid for by dedicated funding should be allowed to be used for an ATV park.

That's easy, it shouldn't. Absolutely not.

This land purchase was a big deal. It was propped up and used as an example of what dedicated funding could accomplish and of things to come. No one who supported the amendment envisioned this property becoming the playground for a local ATV club, which is why that ultimately won't happen.

There you go Goldfish, that last paragraph was the sort of response I'm guessing you want.



Here's where I lose you....or you misunderstand me......


IMO, the real debate isn't whether or not this property should be an ATV park, the real debate is why in the phuck are people riding 4-wheelers like they're some cool recreational vehicle? Dear god, when did this start? No public property should be used for ATV riders, besides ditches.

Because you and I both know these aren't the semi-cool recreational 4-wheelers you can rent in CA and tear up and down some dunes (only slightly less gay). These are your big azz cube-like proportioned ATVs.

Should I post some youtube videos of people riding 4-wheelers, or would you rather watch paint dry? Maybe I could borrow a go-pro (also gay) and have someone follow me on my work commute and post a clip of that? It'd be more exciting.

Can you imagine anything gayer than being part of a club of dudes that meet to putz around trails together on their 4-wheelers? Who in their right mind would voluntarily do that?

Hell, if they got together and all joined hands and walked around town together it'd be the same amount of gay but at least it'd be more productive since they're getting exercise.

If I can shame one person, or someone who reads this shames one person, out of the gay-haze that is the fabricated notion that ATVs are recreational vehicles than I'll be happy.

I would pay good money to watch the ATV club leader have to go to Millville and race the last place finisher from the lowest class of 125's and just get his phucking ass kicked! And then hear him try to explain how ATV's are recreational vehicles. They're not!!!

If you want something to plow your driveway buy an ATV. If you want something fun you can ride some trails with and not look like a phag buy a dirt bike.


Still think I'm trolling or is it sinking in that this is my actual opinion?
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 7:01 am

I guess I've just never been this bored.....

Atv riding up North Askov MN: http://youtu.be/EesGTxrFHBQ


These guys are super gay! Nothing more straight than watching your shirtless buddy do slow wheelie after slow wheelie in front of you. The slow motion footage of their jumps with a foot of clearance was super B-A-

ATV Sport Quads at Spider Lake OHV Trails near Pine River MN: http://youtu.be/q8GNcLay32M


20 minutes of kids riding slowly through the woods. Enjoy!

ATV Trail Riding MEA Weekend: http://youtu.be/Kg7VP81z0xU


I forgot which one this was...if I had to guess it's the one where they ride 4-wheelers down a trail going 5-30mph???

Snake Creek ATV Trails near Kellogg MN. July 2013: http://youtu.be/UIjLJrWE4TI


I was going to cherry pick the really bad ones but didn't get past the first 4 that came up when I searched "MN 4 Wheel Riding."




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shnelson
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 9:30 am

Oh man, if you're this worked up about ATVs, how do you feel about side by sides?

Nothing beats having your broseph riding bitch to hold your hand around that next bank!

I haven't had enough time to read it all yet, but i think I get your general point. It's safe to say I probably agree with the sentiment. Is a "sledneck" any different? Worse?

If there was a "recreation" park close to me - I would probably participate. I bought an ATV as a utility vehicle. I try to make every use out of it I can with pulling or pushing shit around, but frankly, it just sits in the garage 99% of the time. If I could get more use out of it and have a little fun, so what if it meant I was exhibiting homosexual tendencies. At least I'd have a half chubby while doing it.

But having to load up a trailer full of ATVs and traveling a few hundred miles to tear it up with your closest buddies for the brocation of your dreams? fts.

I know I missed the point entirely about improper use of funding, but honestly, nothing new there.

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shnelson
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 9:33 am

And also, now that fowler has quarantined himself to the waterfowl discussion forums, I have to thank you for picking up the slack.

Was getting a little quiet in here without all of the C&P!

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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 12:14 pm

funny.

gimpfinger
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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:23 pm

Wish they knew what trespassing is around here.

I've finally had to spike their trails they made on private land because they don't understand what stay the fk out of here means.

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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:08 pm

gimpfinger wrote:Wish they knew what trespassing is around here.

I've finally had to spike their trails they made on private land because they don't understand what stay the fk out of here means.

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Brilliant just my style!!!!

What is the best method, spikes in a 2x8 buried in the ground?

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Re: Joy Riding 4-Wheelers is Gay and Idiotic

Fri Feb 20, 2015 7:12 pm

Hamster wrote:
gimpfinger wrote:Wish they knew what trespassing is around here.

I've finally had to spike their trails they made on private land because they don't understand what stay the fk out of here means.

Team Power Dump


Brilliant just my style!!!!

What is the best method, spikes in a 2x8 buried in the ground?

Had a buddy weld up some steel tubing with steel rods every three inches. 4 foot long with 4" spikes ground to a point.

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